Doubting the EMG

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Doubting the EMG

Postby anxious06 on September 8th, 2012, 9:34 pm

Hi everybody,

Its just been 4 day since I received the good news of a normal physical, normal bloodwork, normal NCV, and normal EMG. In short, not ALS but BFS. But here I am right now doubting everything. "Is my doctor not experienced enough? Did she misread the EMG? Was she hasty in giving me clean bill of health? Did she miss something?"I know that I sound crazy or hypochondriac. I actually hate myself that Im doing this to myself. To everybody that wants to share his/her personal experience, have you also had this stage that after the neurologist gave you a BFS diagnosis, you start to second guess?!? Or is it just me thats plain crazy to even think about it? :?:
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Re: Doubting the EMG

Postby johnnythejet on September 8th, 2012, 10:29 pm

How about asking yourself "Did my symptoms ever remotely resemble ALS?" or "Was getting an EMG even necessary?"
To answer your question, yes many people have second guessed everything as you are. This is a road you don't want to go down, unless you want to spend another few months or years continually fearing a disease you don't have. Accept the truth and move on.
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Re: Doubting the EMG

Postby Yuliasir on September 8th, 2012, 10:31 pm

i never was in doubt of my EMG (because I was sent to one of two most experiences specialists in our neighbour city), but I know that your situation is very common, because this is how obsessive anxiety works. it puts you beyond relality because staying in fear is for some reasons more important that to be healed. Being 4 years in GAD treatment, I am still falling in some panic on my old mood when it comes to my typical fear (fortunately it is not a health fear, but it does not make my life easier if it comes to falreup :) )

regarding the EMG I can tell you that the changes pointing to ALS must be very specific. They include not only series of muscle firing with very specific frequency and certain ampliture range, but also certain delay between stimuli and reactions (that is why you areasked to move you muscles on EMG), etc. etc. And the doctor jus has no point to clear you out of disease (other than plainly confirm the fact you are oK).

Speaking therapy is a good way (still) to come out of that circle. The question to ask is why I need that fear? What does it mean for me to be in fear of deadly sickness? to be deadly sick? to be only scared? How should i live with that fear? - etc. Usually it helps with some unexpected consequences - yu may found you live on the source of great power being completely blocked woth stress anf fear.
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Re: Doubting the EMG

Postby Bosley22 on September 8th, 2012, 11:12 pm

006, I cannot agree with johnny and yulia more, they are smart cookies listen to them. They are completely right and your doctor is trained to know what to look for. You can bet that if she's giving you the test, she knows how to read it properly. Otherwise the practice/office would have an older doctor perform and read the results if she wasn't qualified. Let me ask you this, i know from personal experience that i would have never doubted the emg had i not read the hundreds of posts of people doubting their emg's; if you had not read anything about doubting, would you be? Just some food for thought

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Re: Doubting the EMG

Postby mike fla on September 9th, 2012, 1:00 am

Anxious you are not the first person on this forum to question their EMG. That is why some people on this forum have 5 or 6 EMG's. The only thing those types of people get from their EMG's is more fear and anxiety. The only ones who benefits from all of the EMG's are the doctor's wallets :lol: .

You need to learn to trust your doctor. I know that is really hard when you are not feeling well but they are the experts. You are also on a forum here with thousands of fellow twitchers who are going through the same thing, have had the EMG's completed and NEVER developed ALS!
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Re: Doubting the EMG

Postby Shanny63 on September 9th, 2012, 4:24 am

hi there, you are not alone in doubting your emg...i can tell u that as i was driving home from mine all those months ago i started to doubt the results..i asked myself all the same questions u did...please believe what your neuro and dr tell u...this is bfs nothing else.... :D
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Re: Doubting the EMG

Postby anxious06 on September 9th, 2012, 8:29 am

You have a point there johnny. My visit started with the neurologist asking me of my history. The only thing that she had aside from my verbal history is the blood work that was requested by my physician the week earlier. After my story,
she started smiling and said that at least once a month, she gets people like me with the same story. She even told me that EMG wasnt necessary and that it would definitely be clean and that I have BFS. I told her that for the sake of my sanity that she do the complete physical, NCV, and EMG. Physical was done without any problem except for she was extremely strong and really made me work out during the muscle testing. :D . During the EMG, except for the period of contracting the muscle, never did once I hear any sort of sound when my muscles are relaxing( she did the EMG on both of my legs and my left arm which the twitching started, doing it on multiple muscle groups). All in all, I guess I stayed in her clinic for about an hour. I was also surprised that she said at the end that all is clean and ok and confirmed that I have BFS, considering that on some posts i read, it takes like 2 days for the neuros to interpret it. Sorry for the rant and thanks for the support. I guess I just need to vent.

ps. by the way, the whole time that I was in her clinc, I only twitched once and it was a tiny twitch on the arch of my right foot. Go figure....
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Re: Doubting the EMG

Postby Yuliasir on September 9th, 2012, 9:17 am

oh never heard about 2 days for EMG evaluation. contemporary EMG analysers usually come with powerful software to analyse various groups of signals, they do stats etc. and the result is really withing a half an hour or so... So do not worry about this too!
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Re: Doubting the EMG

Postby edado69 on September 15th, 2012, 4:01 am

anxious06 wrote:Hi everybody,

Its just been 4 day since I received the good news of a normal physical, normal bloodwork, normal NCV, and normal EMG. In short, not ALS but BFS. But here I am right now doubting everything. "Is my doctor not experienced enough? Did she misread the EMG? Was she hasty in giving me clean bill of health? Did she miss something?"I know that I sound crazy or hypochondriac. I actually hate myself that Im doing this to myself. To everybody that wants to share his/her personal experience, have you also had this stage that after the neurologist gave you a BFS diagnosis, you start to second guess?!? Or is it just me thats plain crazy to even think about it? :?:

I still wonder what EMG is for without clinical backing up
Fasciculating from the 25/03/2007 (as accurately as I can recall!...)
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Re: Doubting the EMG

Postby twitchinjohnny on November 5th, 2012, 3:20 pm

My neurologist reassured me that I had BFS, and not ALS right after the first visit. He conducted the clinical exam for weakness and other signs of motor neuron disease and told me that he was confident in ruling-out ALS. The next week he did an EMG and Nerve Conduction test for my benefit. (Not his.) I'm an OCD case with a long history of intense worrying. My tests results confirmed his initial findings. I have BFS. Nothing else.

Like your doc, he is also a relatively young specialist...... early to mid 30's. I'm old enough to be his father. In spite of that fact, I have to remind myself of just how much training a doctor must endure before they can become board certified in a specialty like neurology. Yes, this guy is young compared to me, but... he's incredibly smart and he's paid his dues when it comes to learning about motor neuron disease. They set the bar pretty high in this profession.

He said that my EMG (except for a few fascics) was normal. In ALS, the EMG results will alway show distinct abnormalities that indicate the denervation and re-enervation of motor neurons. He said he saw none of that.

If your doc says your EMG was good, and that everything else indicates BFS and nothing more dreadful, I say "Hooray!" Like me.... it's your lucky day! Go out and buy a lottery ticket!!!! (I know......."Moving on" sure is easier said than done..... ain't it?)
"If you're going through hell, keep going!"
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Re: Doubting the EMG

Postby twitchinjohnny on November 5th, 2012, 5:50 pm

p.s.- Yes! Hell, yes! I've had my doubts since my doctor gave me the clean bill. (Sorry I forgot to comment on that. That question was a key part of your post.... yes?) That's part of my obsessive/compulsive disorder. I've questioned the test results. I've wondered whether or not such a diagnosis could accurately be made in just two visits that amounted to an hour or so of time. Yes, to all of the above.

Doctors always seem to whiz right through exams. They'll ask you to open your mouth and say "ahhhh." Then they''ll look into it for all of two seconds and say, "O.K." Hell! I've stared into my mouth for hours, only to create more doubt and uncertainty. How can he be so sure in two seconds???? Welll.... he's a doctor. He knows exactly what and what not to look for. I'm no doctor. I only know how to drive myself nuts..... which is a pretty short drive to begin with.
"If you're going through hell, keep going!"
Sir Winston Churchill
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Re: Doubting the EMG

Postby Kamila on November 23rd, 2012, 5:44 pm

Hi!
I also have doubt. I back yesterday from hospital where i spent 8 days. I will put long post about it in other topic where i type about my case.
So my EMG was take only .. 5 min! My neuro said it will take around 60 minutes- also on net i found info its take 60-90 min
http://www.massgeneral.org/als/patiente ... raphy.aspx "How long does an EMG take?
The NCS and needle EMG are usually completed within 60 to 90 minutes."
Man who made EMG was really rude. When i back to my room in hospital i cry and nurse saw it and ask "did doctor again was not nice for someone?Please tell it to boss of hospital". Now when i back to home i see on net people tell he is psycho. He told to girl after crash accident that is all her fault and he start laught.
Back to my case. I said to boss of hospital only that this doctor make only one part of EMG-with electrodes, but ddint make second part- with needles. After 15 min i was called to go again to EMG. I ask this psycho "will it pain?" He answer "a lot of pain but you wanted it". Test with needless was like 2 minutes. My foots was shakeing in clonus then he tol me to not "shake my legs like jelly" i answered him "doctor i have clonus! I dont do it specially!"
On results of EMG he said " he saw some reaction typical for tetanoid(tetanoidalne-in my language) and that he found some myokymia" Thats all.
When doctors comes to my room and told "no need worry because EMG not show big changes" then my neuro said "if someone was able to catch changes" LOL. I know its fighteing between my neuro and this psycho. I will definetelly made EMG in my neuro private clinic.
ALso i am in big affraid because after EMG i fell big pain in legs and hands. I can not even handle plate and now have rpoblem with typeing. I hope this psycho didnt done some damage to me in vendetta that i told to boss of hospital that he made not full EMG
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Re: Doubting the EMG

Postby Yuliasir on November 24th, 2012, 2:02 am

Holy god kamila, it's awful... such person should not work with patiens for sure... it is good idea to have a needle EMG in a private clinic.
as for pain In your hands and legs I can assume it was a kind of nervous reaction. I laso have it after strong emotional shock or extreme feelings. had it always but with the time I started to have real pain and perceived weakness (epecially in hands) after strong emotions...

as for duration of EMG - it depends in fact on what the doctros find. In my case it was about 30 minutes and doc was pocking only my abductor policis or watever it is called - big muscle at the base of thumb. he said if he would find anything worrying, then he would go to the legs etc.
tetanoid activity mean that your muscles are hyperreacting on stimulus (like it happens at tetanus, when person can fall in extreme clonal seizures even if slightly touched by air flow), and myokimia is a rhythmic muscle activity (twitches), just in Greek :)))

so you need more thoroughful study in much warmer and friendly environment.

full of sympathy because of that beep attitude you had to withstand.
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Re: Doubting the EMG

Postby Kamila on November 24th, 2012, 9:53 am

Hi Yulia!
I am very thankfull for answer. I still fell bad pain in hand and legs. I fell it like sharp needle pain. I can not sometimes handle cup.You said You had similar things after stress so maybe its the same. Anyway its started after EMG :-(.Maybe its just how my nerve react on this electricity things especially that i have hyperflexibity and hyperslenderness,limpness,ethereality in hands (lol i dont know which english word is good). Like they told me i can often get some cysts etc.
I going to my neuro private clinic in Monday i will ask him whats going on and also think when make there EMG-just wanted wait till pain will gone.
Thanks for info that EMG sometimes can be shorter time and example only in legs. Maybe i panic to much.
Thanks for explain me about tetanoid case :-)
I am appreciate for Your care!
Regards, hugs!
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Re: Doubting the EMG

Postby Yuliasir on November 24th, 2012, 10:59 am

well, if you have hyperflexibility (hyperpmobility of joints), then welcome to the club because I also have that, and I have read that this syndrome is related to frequent twitches, pains, exercise intolerance etc. I have that inherent, so from the very birth... Before I though I am just lazy because whatever physical activity I tried (even 4 years of aikido), I always was the last in ranks because of getting too much tired and much sooner than the rest of colleagues... Now I think it was natural for me because of hypermobility (in the younger days I was really flexy as a rubber girl ;))) and I am still flexier than the rest of women in my age)...

sharp needle pains are often a sing of sensory neuropathy and really could be provoked sometimes by the deep stress... hope your hospital visit did not find anything more sinister than spinal cyst. if that is a cese, you may PM to Frances (plainslady) - she just went through a spinal surgery to remove a cyst and feels MUCH better after it (less pains, much less twitches, strength in the legs returned etc.). She is also hypermobile in joints do maybe she can tell you much more than me.
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Re: Doubting the EMG

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