Food results are in

[wjjw]

I felt the YouTube clip about the 2 slit experiment seems to suggest that the action of simply visually “looking” at an electron, is what made it change its behavior, and in addition to this you ask “How does MATTER know it was being observed”

So the starting point is we know that observing the electron changed something.

View 1
It is the observation itself that makes the wave function collapse. Either the electron is self-aware, or perhaps the consciousness mind can have an direct effect on the physical world, later in the post you put forward an whole array of many fantastic examples of such a possibility (DNA manipulation, consciously focusing on influencing random number generators). So this view has been well represented. However as you will be aware there is a camp 2 and possibly a camp 3, so for the sake of balance let’s air them.

View 2:
In the experiment the observer is not a conscious agent, i.e, not a physicist actually directly visualising it. The observer is acyually a mechanical detector that is part of the experimental apparatus. In order to make an observation, this inorganic detector must interact with the electron, so this opens the possibility that it is the detector device and not a conscious person which collapses the wave function and destroys the interference pattern.

Steven Hawkins addresses this in his book “The Grand Design”. He says it is the “REQUIRING TO SEE” that changes the course. To see things requires the detector to use photons (packages of light) to hit and reflect off the object in this case the electron. Despite photons having no mass or electrical charge they can still move other particles around. Therefore the bouncing of the photons off the electron changes its energy, momentum and position. The electrons state is irrevocably changed thereby altering the outcome of the experiment.

Hawking likens it to rolling of a football along the ground (the electron). Now throw balls at it from the side (the light photons). You are then going to change the way the football behaves by physical interaction. ( additionally if this takes place in the dark it would not be possible to know where or at what velocity the football was moving before the hit).

View 3:
So in this camp are non quantum mechanical explanations. For example some doubt that the electron fired is the same electron that is being detected, due to the inability to establish the trajectory path.

I think they have recently used other methods to try to determine which slit the particle (a photon this time) went through, without interfering with its wave-like properties. This seems to generate even more arguments and counterarguments. It is termed one of the most curious and perplexing puzzles in physics.
It is interesting that one day in the 1920's when Albert Einstein was out walking in the woods with one of his close friends, he suddenly turned around and asked 'does the moon continue to exist when we stop looking at it.

I do understand and was taught about the observer effect. That every measurement changes the object that we want to measure, and this give rise to the whole question of whether we can ever know the true nature of things. How much it influences an experiment I think depends on 2 factors, firstly how large an influence it is , and secondly how predictable are the changes they evoke Hidden variables is one of the main reasons that experiments have to be reproducible Not everything can be compensated for, but variables can be reduced.

Without doubt the “observer effect” is hugely frustrating for certain sciences such as quantum physics, where investigatory methods influence the situation and velocity of small particles. Also running out into a field of lions blinding them with camera flashes will influence the lions' behaviour, but how far should the “observer effect” be considered. For example should we stop taking patients temperatures because the very act of placing the cool probe in the armpit (or ear) will interfere with the result by lowering the actual true temperature, so the reading won’t be true? No because the end result is the same, the patient has a high temperature. The observer effect has not been influential enough to render this equipment useless.

Radin et al attempted to differentiate in a series of double-slit experiments that appear to favor the consciousness-related interpretation of QM.

http://www.deanradin.com/papers/Physics ... 0final.pdf

Cheers,
Bill

[fargo]

I didn't realize we had a genius here.. actually a couple of them! It's funny how people from different intellectual levels gather here driven merely by ANXIETY Long live anxiety - the ultimate mother of all means of communiacation !!
Watch out, no more bs as a genius might be watching you! But seriously - with people of science chances are we will find remedies for this 'condition' much sooner ..
ps .I heard In the scientific world acupuncture doesn't really work, is it true ?

http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/?s=acupuncture

[wjjw]

ps .I heard In the scientific world acupuncture doesn't really work, is it true ?

http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/?s=acupuncture

If it's published by a senior fellow of an organization that:

....exposes charlatans and helps people defend themselves from paranormal and pseudoscientific claims.

I'd pretty much accept it at face value without even reading the studies myself.

Cheers,
Bill

[SecretAgentMan]

The author has their mind made up that it is true. I do not believe it is true. Which one of us is right? Who knows. I am not a doctor but I am an engineer and no technical slouch. The author has credentials too though. I have first hand tried acupuncture and other forms of energy medicine and believe they were integral to my overcoming BFS. That experience speaks louder to my beliefs than any armchair sideline critics. Has the author ever tried acupuncture though or did they have their mind made up before they even considered an open minded approach? I don't know.

The model that allows acupuncture and other forms of energy medicine to work is usually too much for some people to fathom. It takes a lot of guts to truly admit to yourself that the universe may not work the way you had been taught. There is a lot of fear that goes hand in hand with this realization. What else have we been taught wrong and how much time and money were spent learning wrong things? The knee jerk reaction many resign to is to seek a logical explanation, ridicule the source, and throw out the data that does not compute. The failures are used to throw the baby out with the bath water without ever trying to really understand the successes.

Science has its dogmas too and it makes me sad when people close their minds to concepts that are worthy of exploration because they confuse their dogmas with facts. Our egos do a good job of blinding us to possibilities that scare us on a deep level. Anyway, I can only tell you my perspective on what my truth is. Each one of us needs to decide for ourselves what we are going to truly consider.

[wjjw]

Science has its dogmas too and it makes me sad when people close their minds to concepts that are worthy of exploration because they confuse their dogmas with facts.

That would be called scientism-based medicine.

Cheers,
Bill

[SecretAgentMan]

The funny thing is that many people will adamantly deny that RV (clairvoyance) is even real. And this is despite the fact that analysis and meta-analysis of over 30 years and thousands of ganzfeld experiments has shown that it is. The results produced 32 percent in the protocol whereas 25 percent would be expected by chance. And this was with average subjects, not even those who have natural ability or applied themselves at developing it. But if you really want to go down the rabbit hole and look at the "big picture" illustrating that indeed consciousness effects reality, rather than emerges from it, things like this are far more interesting to look at than its effect on RNGs :

http://www.sinor.ru:8104/~che/birthmarks.htm

Cheers,
Bill

I also wanted to reply back to this post Bill. Sorry it has been a busy day! You are correct that many will deny that RV or clairvoyance are real. This ties back to the whole aspect that our perceptions define our reality. This right here is at the core of all disagreements. Multiple people can watch the exact same event unfold before their very eyes, but each person will have a slightly different vantage point. To make matters more interesting each person has different backgrounds and experiences that give them biases in their interpretations.

People like to see the world in black and white where there is one truth and everything else is false. Unfortunately there can be different truths depending on the perspective you take. A glass can be half full and half empty at the same time for example. What is simply is. It is we humans who define things, put up artificial barriers and thresholds, categorize, quantify, and measure aspects of the world we live in. We tend to get emotionally invested in the perceptions and beliefs we identify with and take personal offense when someone else has another perspective. Perhaps it is our own insecurity in our beliefs that cause us to lash out and attack people who disagree with us? I don't know. Thankfully most on this forum are extremely respectful and civil.

I mentioned in one of my previous posts that I sought out personal experiences so that I would know for myself what it was like to see, hear, touch, feel, etc whatever concept I was studying. I used RV as an example but said I did not stop there. Another area I actively worked on and played with was the 'Law of Attraction' concept that was referenced in the book 'The Secret'. This is one of those such methods, Bill, where consciousness can be shown to interact with the physical world we live in and experience. I did indeed experience some amazing success in my dabbling with the LoA. It kind of scared me at first to realize my thoughts and intentions had such influence and power over seemingly impossible things. This is partly what warmed me up to finally being able to accept that overcoming BFS was entirely achievable and within my ability to influence. Again, it's not magic. Everything that works in nature, does so for a reason. It is up to us to find a way of working with those aspects of nature to our benefit. It is not easy, but it is worth it.

I find it interesting that you referenced the birthmark study as well. Along my journey of discovery I did come to the topics of reincarnation and past life influences on current life struggles. I never had any inclinations or indications that I had lived before. I also had never had any clairvoyance experiences before I started working at it either though, so I was more open minded to the concept than I had ever been before. After reading Dr. Michael Newton's books 'Journey of Souls' and 'Destiny of Souls' I decided once and for all that I had to know for myself. I liked the very unique technique that Dr. Newton devised so I decided to find one of the therapists in my area that was certified in his technique. I was not disappointed with the experience either. I did two past life sessions and found some pretty amazing things out about myself. Although I don't have any birthmarks I did have a birth defect in my left lung that we didn't find until I was 12 years old. It was minor but still required surgery. I have a scar on my left side today where the surgery was performed back in 1991. Guess who saw himself dying of a gunshot wound to the left lung in his most recent life?

There are two schools of thought on past lives. One is that they are pure fantasy made up by the subconscious mind to tell a story that makes sense of the issues you are dealing with in your life. While this makes sense at first, when you start to dive into the amazingly accurate information people come up with in past life reviews there certainly is more to it than just fantasy. The information has to come from somewhere. But where for sure? Who knows. The other school of thought is that past lives are indeed real and our souls can gain access to these deeply buried memories when we go into a trance state. The cool thing about hypnotic trances is that you are able to take your conscious mind into your subconscious where you normally don't have conscious access. It is difficult to do this without drifting to sleep since your brain waves are so slow. That is why a guiding hypnotist is useful because they keep your conscious mind active and awake. They also keep you focused on your goals for finding information out. Past life memories are accessible through meditation too, but it takes practice and determination to go into this state, stay focused on the goal, and stay awake without falling asleep.

Many people ask why the veil and why the forgetting? I personally believe it is so that we can have new opportunities to learn spiritual lessons without being bogged down or distracted with past mistakes. Nobody can say for sure, but it is fun to ponder and speculate. In my past life regression sessions I also found an older past life that was incredibly relevant to my developing BFS in this lifetime. Understanding the ways I did not handle situations correctly or lovingly in that lifetime helped me to see how I turned that all around and did a much better job in this lifetime. It was a really cool experience to behold. I believe it helped me immensely. Whether it is real or not in a way doesn't matter because the fact that it was helpful was reason enough to be happy with the experience.

I do have to say though that I do not think it would be possible to write a better story that fits me, my little personality quirks, characteristic traits, and issues I've gone through any better than the unfolding events I observed while in trance. I don't think 10 Hollywood screen writers could do a better job. It was too perfect. After going through it all I'm convinced it was very real. Anyway, take that for what it's worth. A guy on the internet endorses PLR therapy.

[Watereddown]

Sorry, I know this thread took a life of its own. But day 2 of no gluten, and today was the first day in a while I felt no brain fog. We'll see where this goes

[SecretAgentMan]

Sorry, I know this thread took a life of its own. But day 2 of no gluten, and today was the first day in a while I felt no brain fog. We'll see where this goes

That is awesome news. Brain fog was one of the first symptoms to completely go away when I first stopped eating gluten. Hang in there.

[seventhcandle]

Wow. What useful information. Little Lost, I sincerely hope you will stay on this forum for a very, very long time. It is so refreshing and helpful to see someone with such a generous spirit and solid medical background providing us with factual information about topics like these.

I, for one, developed extremely severe food sensitivities in my early BFS days and determined eventually that gluten was my biggest enemy. Ever since cutting gluten out of my diet completely nearly a year ago, my symptoms have generally improved. I was reacting to all kinds of foods with increases in twitching and still do (onions for example)...no logical explanation for this...but my food sensitivities have decreased over time.

Last night I had some of the worst hypnic jerking I've had in over a year, but I know for a fact it had nothing to do with what I ate. It was quite simply chronic sleep deprivation, over the course of this week, which is just really messing me up. BFS for almost two years and most days I've got a pretty good handle on it.

Again, thank you so much for your insight and input, Little Lost. We also have a BFS facebook group which is private but you can request to join. Lots of good discussions going on there. PM me if you would like the link.

[jcmommie]

What a great discussion! Actually so much pertinent information for me as I decide if I should try the Autoimmune Protocol diet. Little Lost, your posts are fascinating, and sometimes had me laughing out loud. The machine with the swinging arms sounding like a chorus of cats "ZeeZeZe"...snorted coffee up my nose.

SAM, sounds like you have found a good place for yourself to feel better. I am embarking on a similar journey. Just feel I need to do something different.

[SecretAgentMan]

Thanks jcmommie, I am indeed in a far better place now with the lifestyle changes my BFS experience encouraged me to make. Good luck with your journey.

[SecretAgentMan]

Here is an interesting article on the gaining popularity of elimination diets such as gluten free to overcome chronic health issues.

http://www.naturalnews.com/044964_elimi ... gies.html#

[BFSBurger]

Thanks for the reply SAM. She mentioned leaky gut syndrome, and how gut permeability can lead to unwanted substances crossing the blood-brain barrier. it is pretty interesting

What a concept. Go figure. Its like I could have said that myself. Oh wait. I did. 9 Billion times. Dont worry man, nobody here listens.

-B-

[SecretAgentMan]

What a concept. Go figure. Its like I could have said that myself. Oh wait. I did. 9 Billion times. Dont worry man, nobody here listens.

-B-

BFSB, you and I are very much in agreement on recommended approaches to effectively mitigate or eliminate BFS symptoms but please keep in mind that these are recommendations and nothing more. Nobody has to listen to anyone else on this forum, and I can assure you that with tone and sarcasm like the post above that nobody will. I can personally identify with the frustration that comes along with having beaten BFS, coming back to the forum to simply share the knowledge you gained from your experience to help others, and then to have that offering ignored or ridiculed. I personally identify with it because I have been experiencing it for years now. I still come back though because I learned long ago that you cannot take it personally. Each individual must make their own minds up and they have every right to. I learned that when I respect the free will of others they are much more willing to at least listen. A closed mind will not open if you are beating at the front door. When the frustration sets in or you just feel like you aren't being effective, do what I do and take some time off from the forum. Come back renewed, refreshed, and ready to be patient. Otherwise you are just undermining your own cause by driving people away.

[muppetdog]

They need a like button on here.

Thanks Little Lost. Those were great explanations.

Just when I thought science was DEAD on this site