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Re: Chrissi's Therapy diary

PostPosted: February 5th, 2012, 3:32 pm
by chrissi
Slacker, these are the things my doc has written in his brochure, the link between hyperventilation and "tetany". I will try to sum it up all once I am home agaoin and have more time.
The finger stuff is for sure linked to hyperventilation, a low CO2 causes wrong "tetany" and a crawling in of fingers, especially the pinky and ring finger, and a slowed down feeling.
Cheeky, I will write a bit about the diet later too, is is basically about going back to almost nothing, and then building up slowly. It is especially redommended for epeole whose gut nerves are involved in this whole think, like people with IBS.

Re: Chrissi's Therapy diary

PostPosted: February 5th, 2012, 11:18 pm
by Slacker
Yes Dear Chrissi, we have a lot to share about the causes of our syndrome, as we have identical symptoms. About tremors and fatigue in the fingers i think it depends to CO2 level too; when i use them (writing on pc keyboard), they need a major oxygen support and from this all the painful stuff arise; the "slowed down" feeling is very indicative about what happen because i think you mean it seems the fingers move themself slower despite you try to keep a fluid movements: is this what you mean ?

Further, i wonder if the breathing rhythm during sleep is subject to change and so changing the blood chemical; did your doctor tell you something about hyperventilation/tetany against the sleep activity ? I ask you this, because during sleep i often feel the hands/arms swollen and heavy (left hand in particular). I thought about tunnel carpal syndrome about left hand, but there's no clinic/EMG evidence about it. What i see is a left hand muscles restless activity and i think this get tired hand muscles (often i feel this "vibration" during sleep too). It's hard for me think all this troubles depend on the hyperventilation, e.g. why some symptoms sometimes persists for days or weeks (or months) just in a localized body area ? the CO2 deficiency should embrace all the body without "preferred" area despite we have one side more dominant than other one. For example, my right hand is always strong and fine...but my left one sometimes is so stiff and tired that become hard for me to move a bottle to one side to other (i think you have experienced moment like this with your hand(s)); hyperventilation shoot in a heavy way just on limb giving pretty mild symptoms in all the rest of the body ? I'd like to listen what your doctor would tell it about...(despite i think our problems are connected to hyperventilation/tetany stuff) :)

Re: Chrissi's Therapy diary

PostPosted: February 6th, 2012, 10:14 am
by chrissi
It is for sure not only hyperventilation. Hyperventilation has a course, often stress/anxiety. And this same coause also makes somatisation problems. I have those hand problems at night as well, but for me it is more the ulnar region, but when I am semi-awake my hands feel very weird. Tests for entrapment syndromes (carpal tunnel and ulnar) are positive when tested clinically, but EMG/NCS is clear. I do as well have Piriformis syndrome clinically, although my EMG was clear. My doc found a lot of excess water in my body. He said in people who have hyper nerves (which is not only the cause hyperventilytion but also causes hyperventilation) , in most cases also the guts are affected which causes an overproduction of lymphytic fluid which is "stored" in the body and squeezes nerves at various parts of the body, causing those problems. Made worse by our tensed up muscles. I had no really noticeable edema in the beginnings when I already had full range of syndromes, but in the last monthsI notices a mil swelling of my right ancle. But still, only visible when I am very aware of it. But still, I am full of excess water, although I have evem lost weight since BFS strarted. If I remember right, it was around 5 or 6 Litres of excess!!! water at a weight of 67kg and 1,80m.

Re: Chrissi's Therapy diary

PostPosted: February 8th, 2012, 7:44 am
by Slacker
Related to byperventilation and tetany stuff, hypocalcemia is strictly involved. I don't know if it's visible in blood test, but since the problem lies in how the metabolism use calcium where the PH blood is too high (too binding affinity to albumin protein) the threshold availbility for the nervous cells become too little and the sodium ions can fire easily the stuff we are affected. Hyperventilation is a common cause of hypocalcemia. For example when smoking my symptoms get worse drammatically....this is explained i think with vessels constriction...when i did the blood test for magnesium and calcium it was normal but i don't think this stuff is visible with blood test..

Re: Chrissi's Therapy diary

PostPosted: February 8th, 2012, 12:00 pm
by chrissi
He says hypocalcemia by hyperventilation is not visible in blood tests. The blood level is normal, but because of lacking CO2 in your blood it affects your blood pH and therefore calcium cannot be transported to muscles

Re: Chrissi's Therapy diary

PostPosted: February 8th, 2012, 1:51 pm
by Slacker
chrissi wrote:He says hypocalcemia by hyperventilation is not visible in blood tests. The blood level is normal, but because of lacking CO2 in your blood it affects your blood pH and therefore calcium cannot be transported to muscles


So, it's true, it's a metabolic dysfunction detectable by symptoms only. Taking calcium and Vitamin D (D3) supplements could it be helpful ? If it's not a a lack of calcium but rather a wrong way how the body handles it due low CO2 level, i think it's pointless to take calcium supplements, don't you think Chris ? The only way is to correct the breathe i suppose....i've tried some exercises and ARGHHHHH....it's hard to manage the breathe because the feeling of a "air hungry" increases a lot during them....i begin to swear and i feel an urgent sensation to breathe in...! I don't know if it's so healthy doing this exercises for hyperventilation without a precise target because i think a certain amount of oxygen it's necessary for our body; yes i know i suffer of hyperventilation and i have no doubt about it like you, but i'm sure exist standard exercises to correct it but them can vary from person to person...

Re: Chrissi's Therapy diary

PostPosted: February 9th, 2012, 12:46 am
by chrissi
That is what I told you, it is damned hard for someone with chronic hyperventilation to get back to normal: i get a suffocating feeling when i do it :?

Re: Chrissi's Therapy diary

PostPosted: February 9th, 2012, 3:45 am
by Slacker
It's so hard, oh yes! Do you think could it be helpful to assume calcium and vitamin D supplements ?
That's very interesting http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qap3tOvt ... re=related

Re: Chrissi's Therapy diary

PostPosted: February 9th, 2012, 6:50 am
by jerry2
What do you mean by hyperventilation? Breathing shallow and many times a minute? I've watched for example myself, I don't seem to be breathing like when I come from running and are out of breath. I seem to be breathing I don't know, normally... Can I still hyperventilate?

Re: Chrissi's Therapy diary

PostPosted: February 9th, 2012, 8:42 am
by chrissi
Chronic hyperventilation happens without being noticed. You feel like you are breathing normal, is it just a slinght permanent breathing that is a bit faster than needed. Signs are "air hunger" like often feeling the need to take a deep breath/occasional feelings of not being able to breathe deep enough.lCatching yourself often hoding breath .And reacting on low CO2 levels in surrounding, like panicky feelings in full rooms on partys concerts or meetings, suffocation feelings, waking up startled at night with strange neuro stuff.

Re: Chrissi's Therapy diary

PostPosted: February 9th, 2012, 9:04 am
by jerry2
I wake up startled at night with strange neuro stuff and I bump into closet because I am dizzy (if I have to go to toilet at night). How does one knows if he has hyperventilation problems, is there any test for this?

Re: Chrissi's Therapy diary

PostPosted: February 10th, 2012, 4:54 am
by Slacker
As Chrissi told, the chronic hyperventilation attitude might be not clearly visible. There's not blood test, just to check the gas blood balance. Through blood draw is not detectable chemical gas imbalance.
In my case and Chrissi, our hyperventilation is clearly visible: we often feel our "air hungry" feeling. And i suppose who is shooted by the BFS syndrome for the first time and go to google to check for cause and see stuff about MND, hyperventilation explodes (the fear create a terrible stuff related to hyperventilation) and you body become a fireworks target as we know. This should explain almost all the matters what we happened after BFS onset symptoms reading on google about MND. Further, this should explain because the BFS become a vicious circle and just in more time or acquiring full awareness (better just in more time) you will calmn down; further this should explain because caffeine and smoking make its symptoms worse; further, this should be explain because stress and alcool make its symptoms worse too: all this stuff generate strong hyperventilation increasing. I suppose in each person who has BFS, excluding auto-immune causes, there's involved hyperventilation syndrome even in underlying and silent living. And i thank Chrissi (smackkkkk:*) because her experience here reported should be a light for everyone fallen in this syndrome.

Re: Chrissi's Therapy diary

PostPosted: February 10th, 2012, 3:45 pm
by chicagobfs
Chrissi Chrissi Where are you? :o I'm waiting for the diary update :wink: .

Re: Chrissi's Therapy diary

PostPosted: February 12th, 2012, 7:29 am
by chrissi
Hi, I have been very busy LOL, for 12 days I have left my household more or less to 3 men and a dog :roll: and now I had to clear up the rests:) I will update now :)

Re: Chrissi's Therapy diary

PostPosted: February 13th, 2012, 3:32 am
by Slacker
Chrissi, don't worry...your 3 men (and dog) will understand you ! ;)

Rather, come back here soon because we wish to share with you your results and impressions :)